CDR maintenance

[Pascal Costanza]

Hi,

The Common Lisp Document Repository (CDR - https://common-lisp.net/project/cdr/) is for all practical purposes currently unmaintained. We have been receiving a few minor requests recently, but don’t have the time anymore to take care of this.

Is there somebody else in the community who would like to take over and breathe some new life into this project?

Thanks,
Pascal

--
Pascal Costanza

[Svante v. Erichsen]

Hi!

I'd certainly want this project to continue, so I'd consider participating in it. Can you give a rough estimate of the frequency of requests and the effort needed to address them?

I am a bit confused that the project actually seems to reside at common-lisp.net, but claims to be hosted at cdr.eurolisp.org (which redirects to Edi's homepage). How is the work organized technically? Is there a version control repository?

Yours aye

Svante

Post by Pascal Costanza
Hi,
The Common Lisp Document Repository (CDR -
https://common-lisp.net/project/cdr/) is for all practical purposes
currently unmaintained. We have been receiving a few minor requests
recently, but don’t have the time anymore to take care of this.
Is there somebody else in the community who would like to take over and
breathe some new life into this project?
Thanks,
Pascal
--
Pascal Costanza

[Antoniotti Marco]

Hi

I have been somewhat stewarding the project, but do not have much time to do maintenance (read: revamping the web site) at all.

It must also be said that there have not been submissions for CDRs, or requests for much change to old ones in a long time as far as I could tell.

All the best

Marco

Post by Svante v. Erichsen
Hi!
I'd certainly want this project to continue, so I'd consider participating in it. Can you give a rough estimate of the frequency of requests and the effort needed to address them?
I am a bit confused that the project actually seems to reside at common-lisp.net, but claims to be hosted at cdr.eurolisp.org (which redirects to Edi's homepage). How is the work organized technically? Is there a version control repository?
Yours aye
Svante

Post by Pascal Costanza
Hi,
The Common Lisp Document Repository (CDR -
https://common-lisp.net/project/cdr/) is for all practical purposes
currently unmaintained. We have been receiving a few minor requests
recently, but don’t have the time anymore to take care of this.
Is there somebody else in the community who would like to take over and
breathe some new life into this project?
Thanks,
Pascal
--
Pascal Costanza

--
Marco Antoniotti, Associate Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01
DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14 2043 http://bimib.disco.unimib.it
Viale Sarca 336
I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY

Please check: http://cdac2018.lakecomoschool.org
Please check: http://troncopackage.org
Please check: https://www.frontiersin.org/research-topics/7394/network-bioscience

Please note that I am not checking my Spam-box anymore.
Please do not forward this email wi

[Alexandre Rademaker]

Back in 2013, ECL in Madrid, I remember some discussions about the future of CDR. It would be nice to compare with other similar initiatives such as

Python : https://www.python.org/dev/peps/
Erlang : http://www.erlang.org/erlang-enhancement-proposals/home

I’ve also tried to see how Haskell and Racket deal with that. I found this https://www.quora.com/Is-there-anything-like-PEP-but-for-Haskell about Racket. Racket seems to use Github issues https://github.com/racket/racket/issues

Is there still a place for CDR? If so, maybe we can simply use the GitHub infrastructure? We may also try to find incentives to CDR submissions? Maybe associating it to short-papers in ECL/ECLM?

Best,

--
Alexandre Rademaker
http://arademaker.github.io

Post by Antoniotti Marco
Hi
I have been somewhat stewarding the project, but do not have much time to do maintenance (read: revamping the web site) at all.
It must also be said that there have not been submissions for CDRs, or requests for much change to old ones in a long time as far as I could tell.
All the best
Marco

Post by Svante v. Erichsen
Hi!
I'd certainly want this project to continue, so I'd consider participating in it. Can you give a rough estimate of the frequency of requests and the effort needed to address them?
I am a bit confused that the project actually seems to reside at common-lisp.net, but claims to be hosted at cdr.eurolisp.org (which redirects to Edi's homepage). How is the work organized technically? Is there a version control repository?
Yours aye
Svante

Post by Pascal Costanza
Hi,
The Common Lisp Document Repository (CDR -
https://common-lisp.net/project/cdr/) is for all practical purposes
currently unmaintained. We have been receiving a few minor requests
recently, but don’t have the time anymore to take care of this.
Is there somebody else in the community who would like to take over and
breathe some new life into this project?
Thanks,
Pascal
--
Pascal Costanza

--
Marco Antoniotti, Associate Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01
DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14 2043 http://bimib.disco.unimib.it
Viale Sarca 336
I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY
Please check: http://cdac2018.lakecomoschool.org
Please check: http://troncopackage.org
Please check: https://www.frontiersin.org/research-topics/7394/network-bioscience
Please note that I am not checking my Spam-box anymore.
Please do not forward this email without asking me first (cum grano salis).

[Antoniotti Marco]

Hi

I don’t think the problem is the hosting; CLL works just fine and CDR hold only “finished” documents. I think that the main problem is the *lack* of contributions, which somehow reflects the overall status of the community.

How to change the attitude of the community into seeing value in what is in effect a “bottom up” standardization effort, I sincerely don’t know.

Cheers
—
MA

Post by Alexandre Rademaker
Back in 2013, ECL in Madrid, I remember some discussions about the future of CDR. It would be nice to compare with other similar initiatives such as
Python : https://www.python.org/dev/peps/
Erlang : http://www.erlang.org/erlang-enhancement-proposals/home
I’ve also tried to see how Haskell and Racket deal with that. I found this https://www.quora.com/Is-there-anything-like-PEP-but-for-Haskell about Racket. Racket seems to use Github issues https://github.com/racket/racket/issues
Is there still a place for CDR? If so, maybe we can simply use the GitHub infrastructure? We may also try to find incentives to CDR submissions? Maybe associating it to short-papers in ECL/ECLM?
Best,
--
Alexandre Rademaker
http://arademaker.github.io

Post by Antoniotti Marco
Hi
I have been somewhat stewarding the project, but do not have much time to do maintenance (read: revamping the web site) at all.
It must also be said that there have not been submissions for CDRs, or requests for much change to old ones in a long time as far as I could tell.
All the best
Marco

Post by Svante v. Erichsen
Hi!
I'd certainly want this project to continue, so I'd consider participating in it. Can you give a rough estimate of the frequency of requests and the effort needed to address them?
I am a bit confused that the project actually seems to reside at common-lisp.net, but claims to be hosted at cdr.eurolisp.org (which redirects to Edi's homepage). How is the work organized technically? Is there a version control repository?
Yours aye
Svante

Post by Pascal Costanza
Hi,
The Common Lisp Document Repository (CDR -
https://common-lisp.net/project/cdr/) is for all practical purposes
currently unmaintained. We have been receiving a few minor requests
recently, but don’t have the time anymore to take care of this.
Is there somebody else in the community who would like to take over and
breathe some new life into this project?
Thanks,
Pascal
--
Pascal Costanza

--
Marco Antoniotti, Associate Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01
DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14 2043 http://bimib.disco.unimib.it
Viale Sarca 336
I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY
Please check: http://cdac2018.lakecomoschool.org
Please check: http://troncopackage.org
Please check: https://www.frontiersin.org/research-topics/7394/network-bioscience
Please note that I am not checking my Spam-box anymore.
Please do not forward this email without asking me first (cum grano salis).

--
Marco Antoniotti, Associate Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01
DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14 2043 http://bimib.disco.unimib.it
Viale Sarca 336
I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY

Please check: http://cdac2018.lakecomoschool.org
Please check: http://troncopackage.org
Please check: https://www.frontiersin.org/research-topics/7394/network-bioscience

Please note that I am not checking my Spam-box anymore.
Please do not forward this email without

[Svante v. Erichsen]

Hi

I agree that hosting seems not to be the issue. It just needs to be corrected in CDR 4 (adjusting URLs is allowed).

I was just asking about the existing procedure, in whatever state that may be, as I am considering participation. Of course, this should be taken to the CDR mailinglists instead, sorry for that.

I disagree about the judgement of the perceived lack of contributions, though. I feel that it is perfectly valid not to have itches that would need to be scratched on the language level.

Yours aye

Svante

Post by Antoniotti Marco
Hi
I don’t think the problem is the hosting; CLL works just fine and CDR
hold only “finished” documents. I think that the main problem is the
*lack* of contributions, which somehow reflects the overall status of
the community.
How to change the attitude of the community into seeing value in what
is in effect a “bottom up” standardization effort, I sincerely don’t
know.
Cheers
—
MA

On May 22, 2018, at 13:14 , Alexandre Rademaker
Back in 2013, ECL in Madrid, I remember some discussions about the

future of CDR. It would be nice to compare with other similar
initiatives such as

Python : https://www.python.org/dev/peps/
Erlang : http://www.erlang.org/erlang-enhancement-proposals/home
I’ve also tried to see how Haskell and Racket deal with that. I found

this https://www.quora.com/Is-there-anything-like-PEP-but-for-Haskell
about Racket. Racket seems to use Github issues
https://github.com/racket/racket/issues

Is there still a place for CDR? If so, maybe we can simply use the

GitHub infrastructure? We may also try to find incentives to CDR
submissions? Maybe associating it to short-papers in ECL/ECLM?

Best,
--
Alexandre Rademaker
http://arademaker.github.io

On 22 May 2018, at 06:53, Antoniotti Marco
Hi
I have been somewhat stewarding the project, but do not have much

time to do maintenance (read: revamping the web site) at all.

It must also be said that there have not been submissions for CDRs,

or requests for much change to old ones in a long time as far as I
could tell.

All the best
Marco

On May 22, 2018, at 11:43 , Svante v. Erichsen
Hi!
I'd certainly want this project to continue, so I'd consider

participating in it. Can you give a rough estimate of the frequency of
requests and the effort needed to address them?

I am a bit confused that the project actually seems to reside at

common-lisp.net, but claims to be hosted at cdr.eurolisp.org (which
redirects to Edi's homepage). How is the work organized technically? Is
there a version control repository?

Yours aye
Svante
Am 22. Mai 2018 10:50:20 MESZ, schrieb Pascal Costanza

Post by Pascal Costanza
Hi,
The Common Lisp Document Repository (CDR -
https://common-lisp.net/project/cdr/) is for all practical

purposes

Post by Pascal Costanza
currently unmaintained. We have been receiving a few minor

requests

Post by Pascal Costanza
recently, but don’t have the time anymore to take care of this.
Is there somebody else in the community who would like to take

over and

Post by Pascal Costanza
breathe some new life into this project?
Thanks,
Pascal
--
Pascal Costanza

--
Marco Antoniotti, Associate Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01
DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14

2043 http://bimib.disco.unimib.it

Viale Sarca 336
I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY
Please check: http://cdac2018.lakecomoschool.org
Please check: http://troncopackage.org

https://www.frontiersin.org/research-topics/7394/network-bioscience

Please note that I am not checking my Spam-box anymore.
Please do not forward this email without asking me first (cum grano

salis).
--
Marco Antoniotti, Associate Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01
DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14 2043 http://bimib.disco.unimib.it
Viale Sarca 336
I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY
Please check: http://cdac2018.lakecomoschool.org
Please check: http://troncopackage.org
https://www.frontiersin.org/research-topics/7394/network-bioscience
Please note that I am not checking my Spam-box anymore.
Please do not forward this email without asking me first (cum grano salis).

[Antoniotti Marco]

On May 23, 2018, at 11:57 , Svante v. Erichsen <***@web.de<mailto:***@web.de>> wrote:

Hi

I agree that hosting seems not to be the issue. It just needs to be corrected in CDR 4 (adjusting URLs is allowed).

Yep.. That should be fixed.

I was just asking about the existing procedure, in whatever state that may be, as I am considering participation. Of course, this should be taken to the CDR mailinglists instead, sorry for that.

The procedure is quite simple. I quote:


* One or more authors submit a document.
* We (*) check that the document is a printable text document, that it is indeed about Common Lisp, and that it does not contain objectionable material (like porn, religious or political statements, etc.).
* The document will be immediately assigned a fresh CDR number that can be used to refer to the document. We will make the document available for an initial period, after which it will be frozen and moved into final status, unless the authors decide to withdraw the document during the initial period.

(*) the “editors”

Apart from my guilty delinquency on redoing the web site, most of the work has been taking care of spam (an inordinate amount of French spam - go figure) on the mailing lists.


I disagree about the judgement of the perceived lack of contributions, though. I feel that it is perfectly valid not to have itches that would need to be scratched on the language level.

Of course. I do not think that any of the 14 CDRs “scratch itches at the language level”.

Having said so, I do believe that a few more CDRs would go a long way to clarify the corner cases of the language while nudging all the implementations (if they are “nudge-able”) to implement them.

Cheers
—
MA












Yours aye

Svante

Am 23. Mai 2018 08:40:14 MESZ, schrieb Antoniotti Marco <***@disco.unimib.it<mailto:***@disco.unimib.it>>:
Hi

I don’t think the problem is the hosting; CLL works just fine and CDR
hold only “finished” documents. I think that the main problem is the
*lack* of contributions, which somehow reflects the overall status of
the community.

How to change the attitude of the community into seeing value in what
is in effect a “bottom up” standardization effort, I sincerely don’t
know.

Cheers
—
MA




On May 22, 2018, at 13:14 , Alexandre Rademaker
<***@gmail.com<mailto:***@gmail.com>> wrote:


Back in 2013, ECL in Madrid, I remember some discussions about the
future of CDR. It would be nice to compare with other similar
initiatives such as

Python : https://www.python.org/dev/peps/
Erlang : http://www.erlang.org/erlang-enhancement-proposals/home

I’ve also tried to see how Haskell and Racket deal with that. I found
this https://www.quora.com/Is-there-anything-like-PEP-but-for-Haskell
about Racket. Racket seems to use Github issues
https://github.com/racket/racket/issues

Is there still a place for CDR? If so, maybe we can simply use the
GitHub infrastructure? We may also try to find incentives to CDR
submissions? Maybe associating it to short-papers in ECL/ECLM?

Best,
--
Alexandre Rademaker
http://arademaker.github.io


On 22 May 2018, at 06:53, Antoniotti Marco
<***@disco.unimib.it> wrote:

Hi

I have been somewhat stewarding the project, but do not have much
time to do maintenance (read: revamping the web site) at all.

It must also be said that there have not been submissions for CDRs,
or requests for much change to old ones in a long time as far as I
could tell.

All the best

Marco



On May 22, 2018, at 11:43 , Svante v. Erichsen
<***@web.de> wrote:

Hi!

I'd certainly want this project to continue, so I'd consider
participating in it. Can you give a rough estimate of the frequency of
requests and the effort needed to address them?

I am a bit confused that the project actually seems to reside at
common-lisp.net, but claims to be hosted at cdr.eurolisp.org (which
redirects to Edi's homepage). How is the work organized technically? Is
there a version control repository?

Yours aye

Svante

Am 22. Mai 2018 10:50:20 MESZ, schrieb Pascal Costanza
<***@p-cos.net>:
Hi,

The Common Lisp Document Repository (CDR -
https://common-lisp.net/project/cdr/) is for all practical
purposes
currently unmaintained. We have been receiving a few minor
requests
recently, but don’t have the time anymore to take care of this.

Is there somebody else in the community who would like to take
over and
breathe some new life into this project?

Thanks,
Pascal
--
Pascal Costanza
--
Marco Antoniotti, Associate Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01
DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14
2043 http://bimib.disco.unimib.it
Viale Sarca 336
I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY

Please check: http://cdac2018.lakecomoschool.org
Please check: http://troncopackage.org
Please check:
https://www.frontiersin.org/research-topics/7394/network-bioscience

Please note that I am not checking my Spam-box anymore.
Please do not forward this email without asking me first (cum grano
salis).
--
Marco Antoniotti, Associate Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01
DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14 2043 http://bimib.disco.unimib.it
Viale Sarca 336
I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY

Please check: http://cdac2018.lakecomoschool.org
Please check: http://troncopackage.org
Please check:
https://www.frontiersin.org/research-topics/7394/network-bioscience

Please note that I am not checking my Spam-box anymore.
Please do not forward this email without asking me first (cum grano
salis).
--
Marco Antoniotti, Associate Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01
DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14 2043 http://bimib.disco.unimib.it
Viale Sarca 336
I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY

Please check: http://cdac2018.lakecomoschool.org
Please check: http://troncopackage.org
Please check: https://www.frontiersin.org/research-topics/7394/network-bioscience

Please note that I am not checking my Spam-box anymore.
Please do not forward this email without asking me first (cum grano salis).

[Robert Goldman]

It might be nice to get some of the APIs that are in UIOP into CDRs.
I'd love to see some of that code moved to the implementations where it
belongs, and out of the ASDF codebase.

cheers,
r

Post by Antoniotti Marco
On May 23, 2018, at 11:57 , Svante v. Erichsen
Hi
I agree that hosting seems not to be the issue. It just needs to be
corrected in CDR 4 (adjusting URLs is allowed).
Yep.. That should be fixed.
I was just asking about the existing procedure, in whatever state that
may be, as I am considering participation. Of course, this should be
taken to the CDR mailinglists instead, sorry for that.
* One or more authors submit a document.
* We (*) check that the document is a printable text document,
that it is indeed about Common Lisp, and that it does not contain
objectionable material (like porn, religious or political statements,
etc.).
* The document will be immediately assigned a fresh CDR number
that can be used to refer to the document. We will make the document
available for an initial period, after which it will be frozen and
moved into final status, unless the authors decide to withdraw the
document during the initial period.
(*) the “editors”
Apart from my guilty delinquency on redoing the web site, most of the
work has been taking care of spam (an inordinate amount of French spam
- go figure) on the mailing lists.
I disagree about the judgement of the perceived lack of contributions,
though. I feel that it is perfectly valid not to have itches that
would need to be scratched on the language level.
Of course. I do not think that any of the 14 CDRs “scratch itches
at the language level”.
Having said so, I do believe that a few more CDRs would go a long way
to clarify the corner cases of the language while nudging all the
implementations (if they are “nudge-able”) to implement them.
Cheers
—
MA
Yours aye
Svante
Am 23. Mai 2018 08:40:14 MESZ, schrieb Antoniotti Marco
Hi
I don’t think the problem is the hosting; CLL works just fine and CDR
hold only “finished” documents. I think that the main problem is the
*lack* of contributions, which somehow reflects the overall status of
the community.
How to change the attitude of the community into seeing value in what
is in effect a “bottom up” standardization effort, I sincerely don’t
know.
Cheers
—
MA
On May 22, 2018, at 13:14 , Alexandre Rademaker
Back in 2013, ECL in Madrid, I remember some discussions about the
future of CDR. It would be nice to compare with other similar
initiatives such as
Python : https://www.python.org/dev/peps/
Erlang : http://www.erlang.org/erlang-enhancement-proposals/home
I’ve also tried to see how Haskell and Racket deal with that. I found
this https://www.quora.com/Is-there-anything-like-PEP-but-for-Haskell
about Racket. Racket seems to use Github issues
https://github.com/racket/racket/issues
Is there still a place for CDR? If so, maybe we can simply use the
GitHub infrastructure? We may also try to find incentives to CDR
submissions? Maybe associating it to short-papers in ECL/ECLM?
Best,
--
Alexandre Rademaker
http://arademaker.github.io
On 22 May 2018, at 06:53, Antoniotti Marco
Hi
I have been somewhat stewarding the project, but do not have much
time to do maintenance (read: revamping the web site) at all.
It must also be said that there have not been submissions for CDRs,
or requests for much change to old ones in a long time as far as I
could tell.
All the best
Marco
On May 22, 2018, at 11:43 , Svante v. Erichsen
Hi!
I'd certainly want this project to continue, so I'd consider
participating in it. Can you give a rough estimate of the frequency of
requests and the effort needed to address them?
I am a bit confused that the project actually seems to reside at
common-lisp.net, but claims to be hosted at cdr.eurolisp.org (which
redirects to Edi's homepage). How is the work organized technically? Is
there a version control repository?
Yours aye
Svante
Am 22. Mai 2018 10:50:20 MESZ, schrieb Pascal Costanza
Hi,
The Common Lisp Document Repository (CDR -
https://common-lisp.net/project/cdr/) is for all practical
purposes
currently unmaintained. We have been receiving a few minor
requests
recently, but don’t have the time anymore to take care of this.
Is there somebody else in the community who would like to take
over and
breathe some new life into this project?
Thanks,
Pascal
--
Pascal Costanza
--
Marco Antoniotti, Associate Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01
DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14
2043 http://bimib.disco.unimib.it
Viale Sarca 336
I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY
Please check: http://cdac2018.lakecomoschool.org
Please check: http://troncopackage.org
https://www.frontiersin.org/research-topics/7394/network-bioscience
Please note that I am not checking my Spam-box anymore.
Please do not forward this email without asking me first (cum grano salis).
--
Marco Antoniotti, Associate Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01
DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14 2043
http://bimib.disco.unimib.it
Viale Sarca 336
I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY
Please check: http://cdac2018.lakecomoschool.org
Please check: http://troncopackage.org
https://www.frontiersin.org/research-topics/7394/network-bioscience
Please note that I am not checking my Spam-box anymore.
Please do not forward this email without asking me first (cum grano salis).
--
Marco Antoniotti, Associate Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01
DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14 2043
http://bimib.disco.unimib.it
Viale Sarca 336
I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY
Please check: http://cdac2018.lakecomoschool.org
Please check: http://troncopackage.org
https://www.frontiersin.org/research-topics/7394/network-bioscience
Please note that I am not checking my Spam-box anymore.
Please do not forward this email without asking me first (cum grano salis).

Robert P. Goldman
Research Fellow
Smart Information Flow Technologies (d/b/a SIFT, LLC)

319 N. First Ave., Suite 400
Minneapolis, MN 55401

Voice: [phone]
Email: ***@SIFT.net

[Stelian Ionescu]

Sure, but I'm afraid that the problem with CDR process is that if you
don't get buy-in from implementors first, it will go nowhere. Right now
the CDR repository is mostly a dump for half-baked ideas. Is there even
one that has been adopted by at least two CL implementations *after*
publication ?

Post by Robert Goldman
It might be nice to get some of the APIs that are in UIOP into CDRs.
I'd love to see some of that code moved to the implementations where
it belongs, and out of the ASDF codebase.> cheers,
r

Post by Antoniotti Marco

Post by Antoniotti Marco
On May 23, 2018, at 11:57 , Svante v. Erichsen
Hi
I agree that hosting seems not to be the issue. It just needs to be
corrected in CDR 4 (adjusting URLs is allowed).>>

Yep.. That should be fixed.

Post by Antoniotti Marco
I was just asking about the existing procedure, in whatever state
that may be, as I am considering participation. Of course, this
should be taken to the CDR mailinglists instead, sorry for that.>>

* One or more authors submit a document.
* We (*) check that the document is a printable text document, that
it is indeed about Common Lisp, and that it does not contain
objectionable material (like porn, religious or political
statements, etc.).
* The document will be immediately assigned a fresh CDR number that
can be used to refer to the document. We will make the document
available for an initial period, after which it will be frozen and
moved into final status, unless the authors decide to withdraw the
document during the initial period.>>
(*) the “editors”
Apart from my guilty delinquency on redoing the web site, most of the
work has been taking care of spam (an inordinate amount of French
spam - go figure) on the mailing lists.>>

Post by Antoniotti Marco
I disagree about the judgement of the perceived lack of
contributions, though. I feel that it is perfectly valid not to have
itches that would need to be scratched on the language level.>>

Of course. I do not think that any of the 14 CDRs “scratch itches at
the language level”.>>
Having said so, I do believe that a few more CDRs would go a long way
to clarify the corner cases of the language while nudging all the
implementations (if they are “nudge-able”) to implement them.>>
Cheers
—
MA

Post by Antoniotti Marco
Yours aye
Svante
Am 23. Mai 2018 08:40:14 MESZ, schrieb Antoniotti Marco

Post by Antoniotti Marco
Hi
I don’t think the problem is the hosting; CLL works just fine
and CDR>>>> hold only “finished” documents. I think that the main problem
is the>>>> *lack* of contributions, which somehow reflects the overall
status of>>>> the community.
How to change the attitude of the community into seeing value in
what>>>> is in effect a “bottom up” standardization effort, I sincerely
don’t>>>> know.
Cheers
—
MA

On May 22, 2018, at 13:14 , Alexandre Rademaker
Back in 2013, ECL in Madrid, I remember some discussions about the>>>> future of CDR. It would be nice to compare with other similar

initiatives such as

Python :https://www.python.org/dev/peps/
Erlang : http://www.erlang.org/erlang-enhancement-proposals/home>>>>>
I’ve also tried to see how Haskell and Racket deal with that. I
found>>>> this

https://www.quora.com/Is-there-anything-like-PEP-but-for-Haskell>>>> about Racket. Racket seems to use Github issues
https://github.com/racket/racket/issues

Is there still a place for CDR? If so, maybe we can simply use the>>>> GitHub infrastructure? We may also try to find incentives to CDR

submissions? Maybe associating it to short-papers in ECL/ECLM?

Best,
--
Alexandre Rademaker
http://arademaker.github.io

On 22 May 2018, at 06:53, Antoniotti Marco
Hi
I have been somewhat stewarding the project, but do not have
much>>>> time to do maintenance (read: revamping the web site) at all.
It must also be said that there have not been submissions for
CDRs,>>>> or requests for much change to old ones in a long time as far as I>>>> could tell.
All the best
Marco

On May 22, 2018, at 11:43 , Svante v. Erichsen
Hi!
I'd certainly want this project to continue, so I'd consider

participating in it. Can you give a rough estimate of the
frequency of>>>> requests and the effort needed to address them?

I am a bit confused that the project actually seems to reside at>>>> common-lisp.net, but claims to be hosted at cdr.eurolisp.org (which>>>> redirects to Edi's homepage). How is the work organized

technically? Is>>>> there a version control repository?

Yours aye
Svante
Am 22. Mai 2018 10:50:20 MESZ, schrieb Pascal Costanza

Post by Pascal Costanza
Hi,
The Common Lisp Document Repository (CDR -
https://common-lisp.net/project/cdr/) is for all practical

purposes

Post by Pascal Costanza
currently unmaintained. We have been receiving a few minor>>>> requests
recently, but don’t have the time anymore to take care of this.>>>>>>>>
Is there somebody else in the community who would like to take>>>> over and
breathe some new life into this project?
Thanks,
Pascal
--
Pascal Costanza

--
Marco Antoniotti, Associate Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01>>>>>> DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14

2043 http://bimib.disco.unimib.it

Viale Sarca 336
I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY
Please check: http://cdac2018.lakecomoschool.org
Please check: http://troncopackage.org

https://www.frontiersin.org/research-topics/7394/network-bioscience>>>>

Please note that I am not checking my Spam-box anymore.
Please do not forward this email without asking me first (cum
grano>>>> salis).

--
Marco Antoniotti, Associate Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01
DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14 2043
http://bimib.disco.unimib.it>>>> Viale Sarca 336
I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY
Please check: http://cdac2018.lakecomoschool.org
Please check: http://troncopackage.org
https://www.frontiersin.org/research-topics/7394/network-bioscience>>>>
Please note that I am not checking my Spam-box anymore.
Please do not forward this email without asking me first (cum
grano>>>> salis).

--
Marco Antoniotti, Associate Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01
DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14 2043
http://bimib.disco.unimib.it>> Viale Sarca 336
I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY
Please check: http://cdac2018.lakecomoschool.org
Please check: http://troncopackage.org
https://www.frontiersin.org/research-topics/7394/network-bioscience>>
Please note that I am not checking my Spam-box anymore.
Please do not forward this email without asking me first (cum grano
salis).>>

Robert P. Goldman
Research Fellow
Smart Information Flow Technologies (d/b/a SIFT, LLC)
319 N. First Ave., Suite 400
Minneapolis, MN 55401
Voice: [phone]

--
Stelian Ionescu a.k.a. fe[nl]ix
Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum videtur.

[Antoniotti Marco]

IMHO it is a chicken and egg problem. E.g., having the MOP document in a clear and stable place has worked as a nudge for the implementations. But the main issue is that writing quality spec documents is hard and it takes time, therefore YMMV etc etc.

Again, the process is very simple and, alas, pretty dead. I would welcome a CDR on UIOP, but IMHO it will be quite a bit of work as UIOP is rather large.

And then there are other interesting issue, such as the recent snag on READER-ERROR and PACKAGE-ERROR discussed on CLL. Things like this do require implementors’ commitment, but, as we all know this discussion has been going on for years at this point.

Cheers
—
MA

Sure, but I'm afraid that the problem with CDR process is that if you don't get buy-in from implementors first, it will go nowhere. Right now the CDR repository is mostly a dump for half-baked ideas. Is there even one that has been adopted by at least two CL implementations *after* publication ?

It might be nice to get some of the APIs that are in UIOP into CDRs. I'd love to see some of that code moved to the implementations where it belongs, and out of the ASDF codebase.
cheers,
r

Post by Svante v. Erichsen
Hi
I agree that hosting seems not to be the issue. It just needs to be corrected in CDR 4 (adjusting URLs is allowed).

Yep.. That should be fixed.

Post by Svante v. Erichsen
I was just asking about the existing procedure, in whatever state that may be, as I am considering participation. Of course, this should be taken to the CDR mailinglists instead, sorry for that.

• One or more authors submit a document.
• We (*) check that the document is a printable text document, that it is indeed about Common Lisp, and that it does not contain objectionable material (like porn, religious or political statements, etc.).
• The document will be immediately assigned a fresh CDR number that can be used to refer to the document. We will make the document available for an initial period, after which it will be frozen and moved into final status, unless the authors decide to withdraw the document during the initial period.
(*) the “editors”
Apart from my guilty delinquency on redoing the web site, most of the work has been taking care of spam (an inordinate amount of French spam - go figure) on the mailing lists.

Post by Svante v. Erichsen
I disagree about the judgement of the perceived lack of contributions, though. I feel that it is perfectly valid not to have itches that would need to be scratched on the language level.

Of course. I do not think that any of the 14 CDRs “scratch itches at the language level”.
Having said so, I do believe that a few more CDRs would go a long way to clarify the corner cases of the language while nudging all the implementations (if they are “nudge-able”) to implement them.
Cheers
—
MA

Post by Svante v. Erichsen
Yours aye
Svante

Post by Antoniotti Marco
Hi
I don’t think the problem is the hosting; CLL works just fine and CDR
hold only “finished” documents. I think that the main problem is the
*lack* of contributions, which somehow reflects the overall status of
the community.
How to change the attitude of the community into seeing value in what
is in effect a “bottom up” standardization effort, I sincerely don’t
know.
Cheers
—
MA

On May 22, 2018, at 13:14 , Alexandre Rademaker
Back in 2013, ECL in Madrid, I remember some discussions about the

future of CDR. It would be nice to compare with other similar
initiatives such as

Python :https://www.python.org/dev/peps/
Erlang : http://www.erlang.org/erlang-enhancement-proposals/home
I’ve also tried to see how Haskell and Racket deal with that. I found

this https://www.quora.com/Is-there-anything-like-PEP-but-for-Haskell
about Racket. Racket seems to use Github issues
https://github.com/racket/racket/issues

Is there still a place for CDR? If so, maybe we can simply use the

GitHub infrastructure? We may also try to find incentives to CDR
submissions? Maybe associating it to short-papers in ECL/ECLM?

Best,
--
Alexandre Rademaker
http://arademaker.github.io

On 22 May 2018, at 06:53, Antoniotti Marco
Hi
I have been somewhat stewarding the project, but do not have much

time to do maintenance (read: revamping the web site) at all.

It must also be said that there have not been submissions for CDRs,

or requests for much change to old ones in a long time as far as I
could tell.

All the best
Marco

On May 22, 2018, at 11:43 , Svante v. Erichsen
Hi!
I'd certainly want this project to continue, so I'd consider

participating in it. Can you give a rough estimate of the frequency of
requests and the effort needed to address them?

I am a bit confused that the project actually seems to reside at

common-lisp.net, but claims to be hosted at cdr.eurolisp.org (which
redirects to Edi's homepage). How is the work organized technically? Is
there a version control repository?

Yours aye
Svante
Am 22. Mai 2018 10:50:20 MESZ, schrieb Pascal Costanza

Post by Pascal Costanza
Hi,
The Common Lisp Document Repository (CDR -
https://common-lisp.net/project/cdr/) is for all practical

purposes

Post by Pascal Costanza
currently unmaintained. We have been receiving a few minor

requests

Post by Pascal Costanza
recently, but don’t have the time anymore to take care of this.
Is there somebody else in the community who would like to take

over and

Post by Pascal Costanza
breathe some new life into this project?
Thanks,
Pascal
--
Pascal Costanza

--
Marco Antoniotti, Associate Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01
DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14

2043 http://bimib.disco.unimib.it

Viale Sarca 336
I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY
Please check: http://cdac2018.lakecomoschool.org
Please check: http://troncopackage.org

https://www.frontiersin.org/research-topics/7394/network-bioscience

Please note that I am not checking my Spam-box anymore.
Please do not forward this email without asking me first (cum grano

salis).
--
Marco Antoniotti, Associate Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01
DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14 2043 http://bimib.disco.unimib.it
Viale Sarca 336
I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY
Please check: http://cdac2018.lakecomoschool.org
Please check: http://troncopackage.org
https://www.frontiersin.org/research-topics/7394/network-bioscience
Please note that I am not checking my Spam-box anymore.
Please do not forward this email without asking me first (cum grano salis).

--
Marco Antoniotti, Associate Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01
DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14 2043 http://bimib.disco.unimib.it
Viale Sarca 336
I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY
Please check: http://cdac2018.lakecomoschool.org
Please check: http://troncopackage.org
Please check: https://www.frontiersin.org/research-topics/7394/network-bioscience
Please note that I am not checking my Spam-box anymore.
Please do not forward this email without asking me first (cum grano salis).
Robert P. Goldman
Research Fellow
Smart Information Flow Technologies (d/b/a SIFT, LLC)
319 N. First Ave., Suite 400
Minneapolis, MN 55401
Voice: [phone]

--
Stelian Ionescu a.k.a. fe[nl]ix
Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum videtur.

--
Marco Antoniotti, Associate Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01
DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14 2043 http://bimib.disco.unimib.it
Viale Sarca 336
I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY

Please check: http://cdac2018.lakecomoschool.org
Please check: http://troncopackage.org
Please check: https://www.frontiersin.org/research-topics/7394/network-bioscience

Please note that I am not checking my Spam-box anymore.
Please do not forward this email without asking